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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2015 :  15:44:51  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I could take the fairing off and use a tail box. It would reduce my average speed by only 5 mph, 15 vs 20. I am really hesitating cutting off the front end and putting a short head tube on. I have the head tub ready.

C:
Tony Levand
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Jerry
human power supergeek

USA
1475 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2015 :  16:03:27  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
5 mph loss of speed or head tube, hmm, head tube.
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/14/2015 :  17:37:58  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I took the fairing off and rode it around the block, it rides oh so nice I hate to cut it up, but I have 2 other Carp frames in the garage I could make another bike with just a tail fairing. I would be good in the hot summer to ride without the fairing. Seat will be a little higher maybe 12 to 15 inches.

I removed the fork from the Motobecane and cleaned up the headset. Found 1x.035 tubing to make a double tube down to about the chain wheel. New gas and .023 wire test welded fine. Tomorrow I cut it up after I ride to work and back on it..

2015-12-15..
... Rode to work and back today...https://youtu.be/JK__D6BgsNU

C:
Tony Levand

Edited by - alevand on 12/15/2015 15:52:09
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/16/2015 :  09:42:39  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Welded the head tub on, not pretty, had some brass on it that caused it to splatter. I tried a piece of 531 tubing, it doesn't weld well either. Jerry, it it better to use .023 wire or .035 wire? The .035 seems like it has a bigger ball on the end an makes bigger fillets, easier to bridge gaps. Has a little more trail than I wanted, 4.5 inches, wanted 3.5, seat is at 10 instead of 11. Must have sagged in the fixture. Can't work on it tonight, have to visit Mom. I want to leave for the trip on the 26th.

C:
Tony Levand

Edited by - alevand on 12/16/2015 11:21:56
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Jerry
human power supergeek

USA
1475 Posts

Posted - 12/16/2015 :  14:54:55  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
The larger wire is easier to weld with, you have to move a little faster when using .023 wire. Clean the weld joint and at least an inch each side if you can before welding. To bridge a gap, let the wire stick out a littler farther than usual. If you have a wide gap you can also use a side to side weave pattern to help the tubing from getting too hot. Some people also use a U shape pattern. 531 tubing, you have to turn the heat down quiet a bit to get it to weld. Brazing 531 might be better.

I welded the second head tube onto the Rans for remote steering. I need to get the linkage and 2-tie rod ends.
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/16/2015 :  19:47:06  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I took the bike down the driveway and back. I though 4.5 inches of trail would be a lot, it feels like nothing compared to the VP.

I weld a 5/16-24 nut on the end of 1/2 x .035 or 5/8 tubing and screw in the rod end.

:C
Tony Levand
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Jerry
human power supergeek

USA
1475 Posts

Posted - 12/17/2015 :  05:07:54  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
What size rod end are you using Tony? I was looking at the about 1 1/2"- 2" long ones at Tractor Supply for my remote steering. I think the threaded ends were either 5/16th or 3/8th inch. Is that the ones you are using?

Never mind. Found some on Ebay for $9 and free shipping.

Edited by - Jerry on 12/17/2015 05:28:50
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/17/2015 :  09:19:19  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I use Mc Master-Carr rod end ball joints , 5/16 inch. and 4130 tubing 1/2 x .035 or 5/8 x .028 or .035, weld in 5/16-24 hex nuts on the ends.

http://www.mcmaster.com/#rod-ends/=10a367x

quote:
Originally posted by Jerry

What size rod end are you using Tony? I was looking at the about 1 1/2"- 2" long ones at Tractor Supply for my remote steering. I think the threaded ends were either 5/16th or 3/8th inch. Is that the ones you are using?

Never mind. Found some on Ebay for $9 and free shipping.




I rode to work today. The front end is fine, except it is too stiff. I was too conservative on the tubing size and can feel the road vibrations.

:C
Tony Levand

Edited by - alevand on 12/17/2015 09:21:59
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Jerry
human power supergeek

USA
1475 Posts

Posted - 12/17/2015 :  13:48:11  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Thanks Tony. I ordered 2. The ones on Ebay are filmsy to say the least.
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/17/2015 :  19:40:59  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Steering stable at 27 mph, no hands. I softened the front end, welded nut on and mounted the generator and lights, extended the front brake cable housing, rotated brake handles up, they were touching the steering link, humm is that all..was one thing I wanted to do before mounting the fairing, what was it...test ride tomorrow to work.

:C
Tony Levand
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warren
human power expert

USA
6470 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2015 :  05:12:21  Show Profile  Visit warren's Homepage  Reply with Quote
So did you just put it back together the way it was before the virtual link front end experiment?
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2015 :  12:08:48  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
No, it has a 700c front wheel.

quote:
Originally posted by warren

So did you just put it back together the way it was before the virtual link front end experiment?



:C
Tony Levand
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warren
human power expert

USA
6470 Posts

Posted - 12/18/2015 :  17:35:17  Show Profile  Visit warren's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Oh, I see. Before it was 20 inch. Good luck getting the fairing re-mounted.
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/19/2015 :  04:41:27  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
With the 451 front wheel I would loose 6 mph on chip seal, need two spares. 700c should roll and take pot holes better. Putting on the front fender this morning, then trying fairing. Rode 44 miles yesterday, toes got cold. Need to to start getting stuff ready, what to bring on the trip, it's only next week away.

C:
Tony Levand

Edited by - alevand on 12/19/2015 04:52:42
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Jerry
human power supergeek

USA
1475 Posts

Posted - 12/19/2015 :  06:25:36  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Tony, I use plastic shopping bags inside my shoes and my feet stay very warm. I cut them off at the top of the shoe. I have ridden when it is about 22 degrees with just a pair of work socks and the plastic bags. Works for me. When colder, I put wool socks over the cotton blend work socks, then the plastic bag. My feet will sweat then if not below 5 degrees. If you worry about what they look like, I guess you could put the plastic under the socks. It sure works better than anything I have tried.
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/19/2015 :  07:09:20  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Hi Jerry, I was thinking of wrapping the shoes with duct tape, for that duct tape look. Ha! The shimano shoes are just too narrow, too tight for extra socks.
Mounted the fender...


C:
Tony Levand

Edited by - alevand on 12/19/2015 07:13:13
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Jerry
human power supergeek

USA
1475 Posts

Posted - 12/19/2015 :  07:43:11  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Oh no, duct tape would go up in price! Ha I might chop off the from end of the Rans and angle it up so I can use a larger front wheel. Be nice to have two wheels, tires, and tubes the same size. And more comfortable on rough roads. I hit a pot hole in Louisiana and bent the front rim on my Phantom real bad. It is only a 406 wheel. If it had been a 559 or 700 wheel, it would not have gone down in the pot hole. The 406 was just the right size!
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/19/2015 :  09:05:54  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I had the same thing happen with a 406 front wheel. The Elgin street dept cut a perfectly sized rectangle in the pavement...the back wheel went through it unscathed.

C:
Tony Levand

Edited by - alevand on 12/19/2015 09:07:04
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Jerry
human power supergeek

USA
1475 Posts

Posted - 12/19/2015 :  15:32:38  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
[URL=http://s1113.photobucket.com/user/ExclusiveSeniorPhotography/media/IMG_0001_1.jpg.html][/URL]

Thanks to Wayne, I can get back to work on my Rans remote steering. I got the tie rod ends from him. Thanks Wayne. Tomorrow I will cut off the head tube and angle the frame up so I can use a larger wheel. Thanks for the idea Tony.
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/20/2015 :  03:31:25  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
I have an old pair of deadora shores that are a little wider. I can wear a thick pair of socks or a wool dress sock and thinner warm sock without being too tight in the toes. I modified the cleat mounting, so its farther inboard on the pedal. There is is actually more clearance now. These are not as comfortable or as well made as the Shimano shoes. I would not want to walk a long way in them. They sound like womens high heals on tile, but are better for winter cycling. I reglued part of the sole back on. I need to seal the cleat mounts, to keep my feet dry. I tried different insoles, but the one for the shoe are most comfortable, but a little thicker. I am going to wear them all day today. In the summer I wear Nashbar cycling sandals and no socks.

Made and downloaded daily routes for the GPS.



C:
Tony Levand

Edited by - alevand on 12/20/2015 03:40:22
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/20/2015 :  13:31:20  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Not sure what to do on the nose. Test rode around the block, back tire rubbing, windy, garage is creaking and moaning, 20 mph with 35 mph gust seemed to be OK once the bulkhead was in place.

I could carve up some foam, I have some kevlar fabric...no scissors though.

Those shoes made my big toe hurt, so I am back to the comfy shimanos. I am not expecting to be riding in below freezing weather. I could make some booties. I feel much better knowing I could walk if I needed to.



C:
Tony Levand

Edited by - alevand on 12/20/2015 13:45:59
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warren
human power expert

USA
6470 Posts

Posted - 12/20/2015 :  14:39:41  Show Profile  Visit warren's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Can you make a Coro nose that starts at and attaches to the forks? Make it so when you are going straight it lines up with the bulkhead, but it moves with the wheel.
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alevand
human power expert

USA
3541 Posts

Posted - 12/22/2015 :  04:01:16  Show Profile  Visit alevand's Homepage  Reply with Quote
Test rode to work yesterday, the nose should should help speed. I narrowed the fairing around the handle bars last night. I need to make a stowage tray up front and the nose and some more tweaking. It's not so noisy with a bag behind the seat on the drive side.

2012-12-22 I made a route following the MRT. It has 11,000 feet less climbing, 19,000 vs 32,000 feet but has hundreds more different roads and turns. About the same distance to Natchez. I'll decide when I get into the Illinois Ozarks.

http://ridewithgps.com/routes/11543652

C:
Tony Levand
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Grant-53
recumbent guru

USA
554 Posts

Posted - 12/23/2015 :  11:36:00  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
PLEASE do not attach a fairing to the forks! This is the recipe for wind steer. In this case if the fairing is too narrow to turn the large wheel inside, have the nose end at the steering axis. Then streamline the rim and spokes. The front fender could come around the front tire a bit more too.
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Speedy
recumbent guru

USA
909 Posts

Posted - 12/23/2015 :  13:37:10  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Several of my most successful designs had fairing pieces attached to the fork.
Cargo Carrier (design #5) I rode from Santa Rosa across the Rockies to St. Joseph Mo. in the early 80s ... That bike was retired after 50,000 miles and a handful of race wins. 55 pounds.
Super 7 (design #7) had serial production of 9 examples which also worked very well in the "street" environment and won numerous events. 38 pounds.
Interceptor, based on the Pursuit, saw the most production and the most street use plus a few wins. 30 pounds when done in titanium and carbon.
All long wheelbase bikes which had turning circles of 13 feet. A normal 2 way road in America is 16 feet wide.
Understanding center of pressure and center of balance is key to making it work.


quote:
Originally posted by Grant-53

PLEASE do not attach a fairing to the forks! This is the recipe for wind steer. In this case if the fairing is too narrow to turn the large wheel inside, have the nose end at the steering axis. Then streamline the rim and spokes. The front fender could come around the front tire a bit more too.



Steve Delaire

http://molten3d.blogspot.com
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